City Council - Veterans, Military Families, & Military Affairs Committee Hearing on Docket #1775

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Good morning, everyone. My name is Ed Flynn, District 2 City Council. I am the chair of the City Council Committee on Veterans, Military Families, Military Affairs. Today is October 9th. in the exact time is 10.09. The hearing is being recorded. It is being livestreamed at boston.gov, citycouncil-tv, broadcast on Xfinity Channel 8, RCN. 82 Fios, 964. Written comments may be sent to the committee email at ccc.vetsatboston.gov and will be made part of the record. and available to all city councilors. Public testimony will be taken at the end of the hearing. Individuals will be called on in order which they sign up and will have although it says here they have two minutes to testify I want to give every veteran as much time as they need to testify so I'm not going to hold people to that two minutes as a veteran you've earned the right to Talk about your experiences. If you are interested in testifying in person, again, please add your name to the sign-in sheet near the entrance of the chamber. If you want to testify virtually, Please email our central staff liaison shanepack at shane.pack at boston.gov for the link and your name will be added to the list and also for the record I'd like to Recognize Shane Pack, who works here at the City Council Central Staff, is also a member of the United States Navy Reserve. Today's hearing is on docket 1775. This is an emergency order for a hearing to discuss the impact of the ongoing government shutdown on Boston veterans and veterans across the Commonwealth really. Military Families, Military Members. It is sponsored by myself, City Councilor Julia Mejia, and City Councilor Aaron Murphy was referred to the committee on October 1st, 2025. And before I introduced our panel today, I do want to acknowledge Councilor Murphy for being here, for being a Sponsor of this important hearing for being the mother of someone that of a child that is being that is currently serving in the United States Army and Council Murphy have been a long time supporter. of our veterans and military families. Council Murphy, would you like to offer an opening statement?

Thank you. And as always, thank you for your service to our country and always being such a strong advocate for our veterans here in the city of Boston, across the state and the country. You often travel with Commissioner Santiago and others who are going to speak soon. to D.C. and you work closely with Congressman Lynch to make sure that our veterans get what they deserve. So when we have a government shutdown, people are concerned about a lot of different things. So I applaud last week. Right before the council meeting, we filed this emergency hearing order to make sure that we could hold a hearing as soon as possible to make sure that there's no interruption in services for our veterans. Those who are retired, like my 91-year-old stepdad I was receiving care, health care, hospice care from the VA, or my son who was telling me they get paid on the 1st and the 15th, and they've been told that maybe Navy Federal or USSA they can get like one you know very low zero percent payday loans because they're not sure if they're going to continue to get paid so our current active duty veterans in the country on shore. So I guess they said we'll wait to see if the paycheck comes on the 15th. So it is important that we support in any way we can. But to do that, we need to know what's happening and how We can advocate for those who deserve everything and I think even more than what we do give them. So looking forward to hearing from the experts, the veterans, or those who work closely with them Make sure we're providing the services that our veterans here in the city and across the country deserve. So thank you, Councilor Flynn.

Thank you, Councilor Murphy. I do have a panel of experts. I'm going to start. With introductions, and I'm going to ask each person if they would like to give an opening statement. But for the record, we have the honor of a wonderful group of veterans that are here. including the Commissioner of the City of Boston Veterans Services, Rob Santiago, who was the Deputy Commissioner, who was the Commissioner, who was the United States Navy retired, He's a shipmate of mine and a tremendous leader across not just Boston, but really across the country fighting for veterans and military families. We also have We also have Craig Deyold, who's a leader in the VFW for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, well-respected veterans advocate, also a former commander of the of the Post in Jamaica playing the Boston Police VFW Post. He's honorably served in the United States Army and active in the veterans community across the state. I do want to acknowledge Charlie Cook and Dennis Devine, both these gentlemen. serve as volunteers, but they do a tremendous job working at the DAV, which is the Disabled American Veterans, and they help veterans across the Commonwealth I do want to acknowledge the DAV. One of these gentlemen goes to the historic 12th Baptist Church Every other week and helps veterans fill out claims for services that they've earned. So want to say thank you to Dennis. Want to say thank you to Charlie. and the final guest is a wonderful friend as well. All of these gentlemen here are friends, but another wonderful friend, Heywood Fennell, who's well respected across Boston. Well respected in the veterans community, does a tremendous amount of work supporting African American veterans, homeless veterans, but someone we admire, someone we respect for his I do know we have others that will testify and we will get to them in a little bit but I want to give each person the opportunity to give an opening statement There really is no time limit. But let me start with Commissioner Santiago. Commissioner Santiago, thank you for being here. And would you like to give an opening statement?

Can you hear me? Yep. All right. Thank you, Councilor Flynn. And also, thank you for your service. We speak quite a bit. You are a shipmate. I always call you that because you are a true shipmate. I always look forward to our conversations, especially when it revolves around our veterans and our veterans' families and our military community. and also to you, Councilor Murphy, for all that you do for the veterans community as well. As Councilor Flynn had mentioned, you are a Blue Star family and we're very happy and proud to have your son amongst the ranks. Green Beret, no less. So thank you and him for your service as well. And for allowing me and giving me the opportunity to talk about the possible effects The federal government shutdown on veterans may have here in Boston. And also to share what our department is doing to protect those who have served. When Washington stalls, it's often veterans. who feel the impact first and hardest. Many of our veterans depend on the continuity of federal benefits like VA payments, their housing vouchers, and so on. Here in the city of Boston, as we all know, which is the reason why we're here as a city, and many others that always honor service and we will not allow those who have already given so much to bear the burden of what's going on in the federal government with regards to this shutdown. In the City of Boston Veterans Services, we are ready. We have activated a local response. Our team is ready. to offer shutdown support to connect our veterans with any possible emergency assistance that they may need. Offer any of the city resources at their disposal at our disposal, and also to provide information about trusted community partners, many of which are with us today. We will continue to work with other city departments such as the Mayor's Office of Housing, and the Boston Housing Authority to monitor the status of the federal housing programs. We've also been coordinating and speaking with the Massachusetts Executive Office of Veterans Services to expedite any of the state-level relief That's afforded to our veterans and their families such as Mass General Law Chapter 115 and as you can see here today continue to mobilize our local partners like the VFW and the DAV, the New England Center and Home for Veterans, and the Triad Veterans League, just to name a few. Boston has always been the first to stand up for its veterans, from the battlefields of Bunker Hill to our neighborhoods in Roxbury and Dorchester, where many of today's veterans live. We've weathered wars, pandemics, and shutdowns before. But what gets us through is our commitment to one another in taking care of our neighbors. While Washington may be closed, Boston Veterans Services is open, and we're steadfast in our commitment to ensure that every veteran and their family member receives the benefits and services that they've earned. So the message here for us is very clear. Your support. For our veterans, it's local and it's right here. And we stand with you and support you in every way. So, Councilor Flynn, Councilor Murphy, thank you very much for having this hearing and I'm looking forward to the conversation here today.

Thank you, Commissioner, and thank you to you and to your team for the important work and leadership you are providing and your team is providing to our veterans across Across the city, but also obviously across the Commonwealth as well. Commander Diold, thank you for being with us and would like to give you the opportunity to offer an opening statement.

Thank you, Councilor Flynn and Councilor Murphy, for allowing me to have the opportunity to address the Council this morning. It's an honor to be seated with four other esteemed comrades we've all I've borne the battle and have continued to bear the burden of our fellow veterans each and every day as staunch advocates for the hard earned benefits. Again, my name is Craig Diold. I am currently the State Senior Vice Commander for the Department of Massachusetts Veterans of Foreign Wars. My home post is the Boston Police VFW Post 1018, and also a proud Flynn, a resident by choice of the City of Boston, a constituent of yours, Councilor Flynn. Thank you. The recent history going back through all the COVID shutdowns, the VFW has been right at the forefront of making sure that Veterans, no matter what the circumstances is, whether they're a member of the VFW or not, we stand for All veterans to ensure that their hard-earned benefits are not lost and are able to access them. No matter what the federal government does, what Beacon Hill does, and we do appreciate your support from the city. Murphy, and the rest of the council are great supporters of veterans in the city. We cannot do this alone. are proud partners with the City Department of Veterans Services and Commissioner Santiago. Neither of us can do this alone. As much as the veterans of the city that relies on Commissioner Santiago and his team, it's a two-way street. Commissioner Santiago and I are beyond comrades and proud to be referred to as shipmate even for a first soldier that I take that as a high honor but anytime that we can be of assistance and service to fellow veterans across the city. Commissioner Santiago is always quick to reach out, yourself, Councillor Flynn, Councillor Murphy. We appreciate that reach out and reach back. It's whatever the VFW can do to continue to be out front advocating veterans and making sure that our hard-earned benefits are fulfilled. Again, the benefits that veterans really receive are not charitable donations or tithes. These are hard-earned benefits that are akin to the public sector or private sector having workers comp and you know these the injuries the being victims of military sexual trauma PTSD is all Part and parcel of military service. None of us go into the service and expect to come out on the other side being broken or Now in less of a capacity that we went into the service with. So we are earning those benefits that both the federal government, the state government, and the city services provide. We're just looking for to ensure that the levels of government are honoring the contract that we all both signed when we signed up for the service to make sure that those benefits are not lost and continue despite any government shutdown. So the bottom line is the VFW is standing firm. We are going to hold all levels of government accountable to ensure that the hard-earned benefits for all veterans and the military families in our current Military are fulfilled. We've got our National Guard troops right now that are currently forward deployed that are training to deploy that are down on our border right now. And as Councillor Murphy said from her son's experience, they're not sure what's going to happen on the 15th. They're expecting that paycheck, and what's going to happen if that paycheck doesn't show up? The VFW is already receiving some inquiries from National Guard troops and their chains of command saying, If this happens, Are we going to be able to get some help? We don't want to be eating MREs three meals a day for however long it takes the government to get its act together. How can the VFW help? How can the veterans community help? Again, starting from the city level, the VFW and our four posts within the city are standing ready to ensure that Commissioner Santiago has those resources. and we want to make sure that we're able to, from the veterans community, continue to access them from the city. Thank you.

Thank you, Commander. And before I go on to the Disabled American Veteran Representatives, and my friend, my close friend, Haywood, I'd like to acknowledge and introduce former City Councilor, current State Senator, Ian Veteran, Lydia Edwards, who's also active in the Army National Guard as an officer. But Senator Edwards, would you like to join us at the front? We're doing opening statements right now and would you like to be part of this panel? Okay. Thank you, Senator. At this time, Could I ask Dennis Devine from the Disabled American Veterans, would you like to give an opening statement, or Charlie Cook? Whoever or both is fine with me. Go ahead, Charlie.

Yes, I'll be real quick. Thank you for hearing us. One of the biggest problems it looks like we're going to be having is all these new veterans that need benefits. They'll all be applying. and they don't be just put on the back burner and not don't be processed. We gotta get all these organizations to get together nationally and write to their congressmen Get it approved, get this stopped. Right now, we don't have lots of people asking for their benefits that they deserve. They don't be put on hold because it's just a shutdown. and when it reopens, these are all gonna be back carded. So the longer it goes, it just don't get worse. DAV's gonna be working with the City of Boston for anything we can do. City's been great to me, been great to the DAV. We appreciate it. But we gotta get nationally involved, pushing to get the thing over with so our veterans can get the benefits That's all.

That's perfectly stated. My other colleague from the Disabled American Veterans, would you like to give an opening statement, Dennis?

Sure. When we went to the midwinter conference, I asked one of our state senators what happened to the times when Tip O'Neill was the Speaker of the House, and if there was issues, he'd sit down and have a drink or a cigar with both parties and they'd work it out. And I was told that don't work like that no more. And I just don't understand why. They have a responsibility to the country and just the party is more important and I just don't see it. Even back when JFK was alive, they worked together. I don't know why it doesn't work like that. If somebody was a Republican on the city council, you just work it out together. But nationally, they just don't want to work together. But I won't leave any of my veterans behind. I go into the inner city, make sure they're getting their benefits. Making sure they're putting in claims, male and female veterans. And I've been doing it for almost a year now. Very rewarding knowing that they never knew that they had benefits coming to them.

Thank you, Dennis. We're also joined by my colleague on the Boston City Council, John Fitzgerald. John, thank you for being with us. I'll give you the opportunity to give an opening statement in a minute. Thank you, Dennis. I'm going to go to Haywood. For now, but before I do, Dennis, we were talking earlier. I just want to acknowledge Dennis. He goes every other week to the historic 12th Baptist Church in Roxbury. and takes claims, veterans claims, benefits claims to mostly black veterans. Many of them didn't even know that they were eligible to receive benefits. In working with their family, working with their spouse. But that's an opportunity for us to continue to highlight the important work that our veteran service organizations do, but also Rob Santiago's team as well. But it's an opportunity to educate people that, educate veterans that even though you might be out of the service for a long period of time, You have earned benefits. No one's giving you anything. You've earned these benefits, and it's still not too late to apply. Having said that, let me go to my good friend, Heywood Fennell, and then I'm going to go to Senator Edwards, but Heywood, You're on the hot seat, Haywood, but we're honored to have you, and you're a wonderful veterans advocate.

My name is Haywood Fennell. I'm a veteran. And I just want to thank you for having this meeting. You know, when we raise our hands as veterans to serve our country, Our hands never go down. They remain up and they need to stay up, especially during these times because veterans are trying, folks seem to be trying to reconquer We serve our country. Triad Veterans League is an organization that does not fit the mode What people think veterans organizations should be, but we represent the veterans in our community through our programming. And I think that it is an affront To veterans not only in Boston, but across the nation of what's going on in terms of not wanting to give us what we have earned. They're not giving us anything. We earned that. And so what TRIAD does is we work to build the presence of veterans in our community through our programming that includes literacy, mental health, going into prisons, Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Certainly appreciate the Commissioner, Santiago, and what he's doing in the community. And we're looking forward to a continued presence working with the Commissioner and the City of Boston. Thank you.

Well, thank you, Haywood. We have great respect for you. And Haywood mentioned a word. I just wanted to highlight the word. He mentioned bad paper. And I wanted to at least educate the public on what that means Myself and Rob Santiago, a lot of veterans that were gay and lesbian were discharged from the military because of the fact that they were gay or lesbian. The military may have put down that they had some type of behavioral issue or there was some type of other issue. Not necessarily saying they were discharged for that particular reason, but that was the reason. And they were discharged also, obviously, for being gay and lesbian. But myself, and especially Commissioner Santiago, we worked with a lot of veterans and with people in Washington, thanking the Obama administration, really. But veterans that were discharged with bad paper, which means you didn't necessarily receive an honorable discharge, which limits the benefits that you were entitled to. But under President Obama, they made changes where you could appeal that bad paper discharge so it can be upgraded to an honorable discharge, but really A lot of that conversation started here in Boston under Commissioner Santiago. It was kind of a grassroots movement and other cities talked about it, but it was veterans organizations, it was people of goodwill that wanted to ensure that Gay and Lesbian service members were treated with respect. And just want to acknowledge Commissioner Santiago for the leadership he played here in Boston, but also across the country. I think all five have already testified. I do want to give an opportunity to State Senator Lydia Edwards, currently a member of the National Guard and officer in the United States Army. Senator Edwards, would you like to give an opening statement, please?

Thank you very much. I want to thank you, Councilor Flynn, for the opportunity and inviting me to come and talk today. And just to add some context, not only Did I take that pledge? Only two years ago actually to join the military. I am a military brat. My mother raised myself, my twin sister, all over the world. and for 23 years she served this country. So I know what it's, I grew up on military bases and military facilities and the DOD schools and so access to all of these Not even benefits, just quality of life issues for people in the military are directly impacted by a shutdown. Directly impacted. And I can't think of how my childhood, my education, My ability to live honestly on the base would have been impacted if we had shutdowns back then. But we didn't really have shutdowns back then. This was in the 80s to 90s. The shutdowns weren't on. Really the table, as you mentioned before, sir, about how people tended to put party aside and get along. So I'm here to talk about that experience from being a military brat to now being In the military, I can tell you I was in school during this past December. I was at JAG School in Charlottesville, Virginia. And I will tell you the real Thank you for joining us. I will give that bank a lot of credit. They will loan you the money and help you be paid on time. Then there was the question of what is my wife, what are my kids, what are we going to do because I'm away. The BAH, which is the housing allowance that basically pays your mortgage and everything like that, that's all cut off. And so my classmates, who had kids and partners and wives and husbands at home, we all wondered what was going to happen while we were stationed over in Charlottesville. So it's a real lived experience. Luckily, we didn't have the shutdown then. But I think about my classmates now, the future Jags, the ones who are there, they're in the middle of a shutdown. And so school's canceled. So there's a lot of different aspects and I'd love to, you know, when we go back and forth on ways in which the city can respond to it, I have a couple ideas, Councilor Flynn, but thank you so much for this opportunity.

Thank you, Senator Edwards, and thank you for your service and When you were on the city council, you always talked about military families and you brought a unique perspective to the city council talking about the service of your mother, retired Air Force, but The conversation you brought to the City Council was very helpful to a lot of military families across the Commonwealth, so I want to say thank you to You, Senator Edwards, but also to your family as well for their sacrifice. At this time, I would like to ask Councilor Fitzgerald, would you like to provide an opening statement?

Thank you, Chair. Just very briefly, I don't have the experience that my current and former counselors certainly have in the military, whether it's having served or having children that serve currently. But I have the utmost respect for what you guys do. And where we stand now today is not a good place. for our veterans. And really, I'm here to learn how I can be helpful, how this council can be helpful and supportive to you all going forward. So really just here to learn from you all as you guys have the lived experience and made that sacrifice and forever thankful for that. Thank you, champ.

Thank you, Council Fitzgerald. I'm going to do something a little different at this committee hearing. We usually go into question and answering from the City Council colleagues, but there is a... There are two people here from the New England Center for Veterans. They play a critical role in leadership in our city. I do want to hear from them, and then we'll go into Q&A, or if anyone else would like to testify. But I do want to give the New England Center for Veterans the opportunity to testify because I believe your testimony would be very helpful in this discussion and as we prepare for Q&A. Yeah, you could sit up there, sir. I'm honored to have you here. And if you want to introduce yourself and give an opening statement and let us know what's on your mind.

Sure, certainly. Good morning. My name is Warren Manigault. I'm the Vice President of Operations and Facilities Management at the New England Center and Home for Veterans. I just wanted to say this morning, good morning to you, Councilor Flynn, Councilor Murphy, Senator Winchester-Santiago, and Councilor and other federal veterans who are here. On behalf of the New England Center Home for Veterans, I want to express our sincere appreciation. And for your leadership and partnership, Councilor Flynn in particular, as well as Commissioner Santiago and of course Mayor Wu, And on behalf of the New England Center for Veterans, we really appreciate the support you give us with the vulnerable veterans that we proudly serve. At this time, we don't anticipate any interruption or disruption. of our federal funding from the Department of Veterans Affairs. We're in close regular contact with the leadership at VA Boston, and we continue to work in concert with the city and other government partners as well We're also staying alert to any secondary impacts that may occur should the shutdown continue extendedly. whether they be housing instability, effects on other federal services we provide, or any anxiety or collateral anxiety that may arise within the community that we serve. We're closely connected with our partners at the VA and the Commonwealth and the city to make sure that our veterans continue to receive services with dignity and stability that they earned and deserve. As a veteran of the United States Air Force and Massachusetts Air National Guard during Desert Storm, we thank you. I thank you personally for your support and for calling this hearing today. And I appreciate you inviting us to testify.

Well, thank you, Warren. We're honored to have you. We have great respect for the New England Center for Veterans for the critical role they play in our Commonwealth. Would anyone else from the public I'd like to testify before I go to Q&A. Okay. At this time, I'm going to go to Q&A from my colleagues. I'll ask questions at at the end. So I'll go to Council Murphy, Council Fitzgerald, and then I'll ask questions and we'll take it from there. Council Murphy.

Thank you. Thank you all for your Opening statements and reminding me something that I do know, but always reminded that not all of our veterans and their families know is that we have wonderful people, city agencies, state, federal, nonprofits out here. across our city who want to make sure our veterans get everything that they deserve. But the scary thing for me is many of our veterans don't even know what is available to them and now we could have a possibility where there's going to be a gap or delays in services that they do receive. So if anyone could speak to what we think would happen if there were delays or gaps and what that would mean to You say your commission, Commissioner Santiago, and what we could do on the council to step in. I did talk about the conversation I had with my son just this morning about some of his You know, veteran peers, they're saying they are worried about the 15th, they're not sure, and they are applying to that USAA, you know, 0% payday loan or the Navy Federal, just to be prepared. So what can we say to our Veterans if they call or we find out that the unthinkable does happen and there's gaps or delays in services.

Here in the city of Boston, we are prepared for any gaps. We do have a playbook that we use from prior shutdowns. And that playbook is primarily the state benefit and also Our Bridge to Gap program that we have in the City of Boston Veterans Services. One of the discussions that we're having with EOVS is Chapter 115 to possibly, again, expedite any applications that may come in because of the shutdown of our veterans and also possibly being able to waive some of the requirements on the chapter work 15 to be able to take care of our veterans and their families utilizing that program but here in the city thanks to the mayor and of course the council We also have the Bridge the Gap program. Wherever we are unable to provide any benefits on the Chapter 115, we could go ahead and utilize the Bridge the Gap program to again fill in any of those and many more gaps that our veterans may have prior to that. If I can, Charlie brought up a very good point that I also wanted to bring up. How the VA claims are still being processed through these great organizations that we have up here today and also through the other VSOs that we have throughout the state. But once they get to the federal level, that's where they're stopping. That's where it's stopping, going back to what Charlie said. And then any backlog that we were able to take care of is no longer going to be there because now there's going to be a new backlog. of all these VA claims from a lot of our veterans that earn and deserve those benefits. So with that said, there is a veteran's field guide to the government shutdown that was put out by the VA and this is something that we have posted and I will make sure that we post again. Just wanted to go over the services that are impacted. One, the VA will cease providing transition program assistance and career counseling. The call centers for the VA GI Bill and the National Cemetery Applicant Assistant Hotlines will also be affected and closed. VA Benefits Regional Office, which are the ones who process the VA claims, will be closed. Public affairs and outreach to veterans will cease. including social media, vet resources, emails, and responses to press inquiries. No grounds maintenance or placement of permanent headstones are going to be happening at VA cemeteries. Applications for pre-need burial at VA cemeteries will not be processed. and no printing of new presidential memorial certificates will be processed and no outreach to state, county, tribal, municipal, faith-based and community-based partners by VA central office will be happening as well. The services that will not be impacted by the VA are the VA medical centers, the outpatient clinics, VA centers. They will all be open as usual and providing all services. VA benefits will continue to be processed and delivered including compensation, pension, education, and housing benefits. Those are the ones that are currently have been approved by the VA. Burials will continue at VA National Cemeteries. Applications for headstones, markers, and burial benefits processing, however, will also continue. The Board of Veterans Appeals will cease decisions on veterans cases, which is what we were talking about. Call centers, the VA primary call center, the 1-800-MIC-VA-411, and the Veterans Crisis Hotline, which is dialed 988-PRESS-1, will remain open 24-7. That is crucial for our support for our veterans. and the Suicide Prevention Program, Homelessness Services and Caregiver Support will also continue. This again, we are having a post, Make sure that it gets out to our veterans in every way possible. This obviously being one of the ways that we're doing it. But also, we will be working with our partners up here to ensure that we could fill those gaps with the services that are being impacted.

thank you I'm going to look at that guy closely but you mentioned The National Cemetery, so that would include Bourne?

Yes, correct.

And could you say again, because it was listed on the interrupted side, but then also things that aren't. What would be interrupted? This is... Unfortunately, very personal, my dad is buried at National Cemetery, and his wife, my stepmother, is unfortunately only days away from joining him so we are in the process of switching out that headstone and knowing that I'll keep the one that's there because it just has his name now but she was a navy brat but married to my dad who was in the navy so There will be interruptions to what?

The groundskeeping is going to be interrupting and also the placement of headstones as well.

Not the burial, just the renewal of the placement. Correct. Thank you for that. I think it's important to like to know exactly what is going to be affected so support us. One other thing and you mentioned the bowling you guys do at Boston Bowl but you every other Thursday you go to the 12th Baptist Church and It's really not a question but just I think oftentimes in this conversation about our veteran services but all city services we need to like meet people where they are where they feel comfortable and many times people will say reach out to our offices or Your offices, and you spoke a lot, Craig, about when people come to you. Maybe it's not directly what you're going to provide for them by connecting people to other places. What advice, like how can I be a better ally? How can our colleagues here on the council be better allies when they reach out to us? Because I know your office, Rob, is always, your phone is always ringing and your staff is amazing supporting, What other agencies can we connect people with to make sure that there's no gaps or fear? Many times they're just calling because they're just concerned, which they should be.

Well, our office definitely, and I always have to say, and I always, as much as I possibly can, always publicly state that I'm very fortunate to have the amazing empathetic and professional staff that we have at Veterans Services. And one of the things that we do and that we preach is that no veteran is left behind. We do get calls from veterans from other municipalities, and we always do what we can to do a warm handoff Thank you for joining us. to our success in taking care of our veterans and their families as well. Having the New England Center always being responsive and receptive whenever we do call, whenever there's a veteran in need who may be experiencing homelessness, and they're there to help out as well. being able to talk to Charlie or to Dennis about a VA claim, being able to talk to Craig on a daily basis about advocacy work in the veteran space. And again, I'm just bringing these examples, but this is something that all these organizations do Every single day, the advocacy part to taking care of our veterans, to helping them out and assisting them with their VA claims. So while we do have the City of Boston Veterans Services, I cannot do it alone. My staff cannot do it alone. It's having to support and the advocacy of these other organizations here in the city. Again, like the VFW, like the DAV, like the American Legion, like Triad Veterans League, really, really goes a very long way to ensuring that our veterans are taken care of. and a way to get a hold of them is either through our office or to even just go online and look up the information for them either through VFWMA.org or through DAVMA.org as well. I think it's DAVMA.org, right? Yeah, so those are just a couple of different ones to talk to, but it's just been amazing working with these groups, and I'm very fortunate to be able to have them by my side.

Thank you. I'll just end by saying it's another strong reminder that your budget is not large enough. And during the amendment process, I know Council Flynn and I It was a painful year where we were considering even pulling from your budget, which I think is way too small. Like we should be increasing because you're already having to lean on so many other agencies and you do amazing work. Thank you for all you do and I'll just continue to be supportive and make sure that we're giving you the funding, especially during a shutdown. Maybe there's a need for additional funding and services or other departments. like we're doing during election season now. We talked about knowing receivership so other departments can step in and support if needed, but making sure if there's other city agencies if needed to take calls or field any concerns that our veterans have. help support that in any way.

Thank you, Councilor. And I do also want to talk a little bit about that point. We do have a great working relationship, obviously, with other city agencies and departments. in concert to help our veterans, Age Strong Commission, Food Access. Pretty much every department that we have in the city, they've been paramount in ensuring the success of our veterans as well.

That's great. Thank you.

Thank you, Council Murphy. Council Fitzgerald?

First, I just want to say thank you to Shane. I'm sure you guys did at the beginning as well, but I missed it. So, Shane, thank you for your service as well from central staff here. Solutions, right? What do you all think? When we talk about, we kind of feel a little helpless, right? When things are stopping at the federal level and we're just city and state here, you sort of just go, well, what can we do? Is there anything in action? Is there any way to amplify our voice? Is there any organization happening that is sort of saying, Making a veteran's voice known that we are displeased with the shutdown and what the effects could be and how is that working and how we feel it could be better and how do we feel that we could all help?

I just wanted to add to what the Commissioner was saying about disseminating information as it relates to betterment services. You know, I look at, you know, Channel 4, 5, and 25, and while this particular program is on, I think you said Channel 8? A lot of people don't look at eight. And I think that there should be some coordination for information regarding this particular subject and all of that should be something that the media should be involved in for strategy Thank you. Thank you. and a television program. And we talk about what's going on with the veterans. But imagine if you had a strategy and people talking about veterans' needs and they do have needs and the services that are being provided like the DAV, the VFW, Triad and any other organization New England Shelter for Homeless Veterans. People don't know about how we take care of ourselves and why we are doing what we do because we serve this country. And I don't want to sound like I'm preaching, but I am preaching because we need to use these entities around media so that people can understand why We need to fight back, but not as a finger, but as a fist.

Thank you. We have a great opportunity with the DAV to get our message out This year, one of South Boston's own, Coleman Nee, has been elected the head of the national commander for the DAVs flying all over the country. He was for Our state veteran service commissioner for the state for a few years. He's one of the great advocates for veterans. He's doing a great job. He's all over the country. And like I said, we gotta get All the states coming, not just us, because it's just politics right now. We gotta get all the veterans around, talking to them, no matter what party they're congressmen in. Let's get this settled and get it going again for the veterans. Thank you.

Mr. Councilor, through the VFW's Washington, D.C. office, even though the federal government might be shut down, our Washington, D.C. office is still very active. They are still on the job. and they are still conducting outreach with our congressional delegation and not only with the Commonwealth but across the country. Our D.C. office, again, is steadfast. They are constantly testifying before Congress, both the House and the Senate. Now, they've got some great prime real estate right across from the Hart office building, so they are literally at arm's reach to the VFW, and the VFW is not afraid to go and knock on doors to make sure that Our message is being heard throughout the halls of Congress. Just a few weeks ago, the VFW had our fall legislative conference in Washington, DC, where we had representatives from all across the country as well as Europe and the Pacific Island areas all descended upon Capitol Hill to ensure that Our legislators are doing their job in making sure that our advocacy is not falling on deaf ears. and that was during the roll-up and there was just talk about potential shutdowns so our message was clear you will not harm veterans benefits during this process you know our veterans All of these benefits the hard way. These aren't just gimmies. These are very hard-earned benefits that the VFW, the DAV, the Legion, We've all fought for time immemorial. But looking at the comrades at this table, a lot of us are members of more than one organization. Myself, I'm a Now I'm a proud VFW member, but I'm also a member of the DAV and of the American Legion. We are very cross-pollinated, so our network is very strong, especially here in the city of Boston. We've got a very tight group of veterans here that when we need our voice to be heard, we're going to make it, and you will hear it. and that goes for Beacon Hill as well. We have our office right inside the State House. It is active and our state legislative officers are knocking on our delegation's doors to make sure that, hey, Veterans are still out here. We still need to be heard. We need to be advocated for. And yes, you are going to listen to us. But a lot of us, again, our networks, are what speak volumes. You hear the term, I got a guy. At this table, we got a lot of guys that are within one phone call or one email away from each of us that when a veteran comes to us, It might not be something that the VFW might have that great contact for or has that one asset that we can say, hey, I'm going to call Dennis with the DAV. And he's the guy. He's a great guy. He's going to be able to help you out with it. So we are not afraid. We're not that parochial. We're just saying, okay, yeah, the VFW is just going to take this. We can't operate alone. We rely closely on our partners, partner veteran service organizations. Commissioner Santiago's department is Bar none outstanding. And as another little parting shot is when we were having the budget issues last time and the discussions, they were very, very difficult within the city. One thing to realize is the rest of the Commonwealth pays attention. All the other cities and towns pays very close attention to what Boston does. Boston's the big kid on the block, and a lot of times the way Boston goes, The other towns and cities will follow. So please keep that in mind as you're discussing our upcoming budgets that your decisions here will affect Veterans across the Commonwealth, because other smaller towns might say, oh, Boston slashed this. We can do that, too. They got away with that. I'm not saying that that's the case, but we want to make sure that that is put into your thought process as well. Boston is the leader on so many things on so many different levels, and that's what makes this city great. But just to remember that as Boston goes, a lot of times the rest of the Commonwealth will as well.

Thank you, Commander. Of course, Senator Edwards.

Thank you, Councilor. You asked a question about solutions. And one of the things that came up recently was the gay, lesbian veterans who have been wrongfully discharged. and the wonderful solutions and movement that Commissioner Santiago yourself put through. I just wanted to note there's a state level solution and then also possibly an opportunity for a city level creation of a solution on that particular issue. At the state level, we created the VERB, the Veteran Equity Review Board, where veterans, and it's been expanded to beyond gay, lesbian, to trans, to racial discrimination, to gender discrimination, where if a veteran feels that they have been wrongfully discharged, they can appeal to this civilian review board. It's kind of like the We have an Army Review Board as well, as you know, that can correct records. This is a state level, and so this would allow, we can't correct the actual record, but we can say, that based on our review of how you were discharged, you are entitled to state level benefits. and they can be reinstated for that particular veteran. So that in the civil service benefits, all of the benefits that come from the HERO Act, All of the ways in which we have at the state have preferenced or helped veterans find housing. And my thought is, why not create a city version of that as well? If there are city benefits, if there are housing benefits, if there are ways in which you are benefiting That you do that third level review of somebody who was removed wrongfully from the military, that they could also say, you know, I've gone to the state, I've gone federally. and I'm going home too, to think about how, whatever the list is, whether it's the Boston Police Department, whether it's for the firefighters, whatever the benefits are, speaking of which, Also passed in the HERO Act, another solution and benefit for veterans that has nothing that moves beyond the shutdown is we've given cities and towns the opportunity to opt in. to reserve 10% of their affordable housing programs for veterans. So that's allowed. And so Boston could do that as a local option. and that is not necessarily responding to the shutdown, but it's certainly making it shutdown proof. So sometimes we can't just respond to the immediate response. We gotta be planning Whether there is or isn't a shutdown, how we take care of our veterans. So I just wanted to give that out. And I apologize, but I will be going back to Beacon Hill to take care of our veterans. Thank you, Senator Edwards, and thank you to the State Senate, to the

State leaders to Governor Healey and Lieutenant Governor Driscoll. They've been real champions on veterans, veterans issues and want to say if you had passed that along to them from us that We have a strong partnership, Rub, Santiago, with our state partners as well. So we want to say thank you to you and to the Healey and Driscoll administration for always supporting veterans. Thank you. Thank you, Senator Woods. Thank you very much. and Council Fitzgerald.

Yeah, no, I just wanted to, I think that concludes and I just want to say thank you again and apologize that I have to run to the next thing as well. But to thank you all for your service and maybe as a suggestion, Well, there were great solutions offered and I think we should follow up on those on the shutdown specific. Maybe this body could put together a letter stating some of the things we've learned today and heard today and send it not just to our congressmen here in the state, and Congressmen and Women, but maybe across the country to just say, look, Boston is asking all of you. to sort of cut it out, right, and support our veterans here because these are the people that fought for our country and now these are the people we're hurting. So maybe that's something we can look at doing it.

No, that's a great suggestion, Council Fitzgerald. Maybe we'll partner on that. Thank you. I also want to recognize the original co-sponsor as well for Mejia. Thank you for your leadership for the important work you are doing. Councilor Mejia, you have the floor whether you want to give An opening statement and then go right into question Q&A. So I want to give you the opportunity, Councilman Mejia.

Thank you, Councilor. And I apologize for being late, but I needed to be here to show up for you all. And I really am grateful to Councilor Flynn for his relentless leadership. when it comes to veterans here on the Boston City Council. So you have one of the biggest champions here and modeling that behavior, not just here in Boston, literally going to DC advocating on behalf of our veterans. So I just want you all to know you're in good hands. And then you have me, his little sidekick, who loves to fight. I take my marching orders from the people and so really excited to be with you all. I've learned a lot in my time here on the Boston City Council and I have come to realize that all communities are at risk But the biggest risks are the ones that have dedicated their lives to ensure that we can even have freedom here in the city of Boston or even in the country. I just want to thank each of you for your service. It is not lost on me the impact that you have made and the sacrifices. And so what we need to do now is make sure that we are showing up for you in a way that is going to You know, stand up to those folks we're trying to take away. Everything. And I know that we had two eager veterans there as soon as before you acknowledged me that I saw their hands up and I would love to be respectful before I ask my questions to allow all of that energy that was coming from that side over there to go first and then I'll ask my questions and thank you.

Great recommendation, Councilor Mejia. Let me go to my friend Haywood and to Dennis.

I just wanted to...

Hey, Heywood, can you talk more into the microphone?

In this meeting about Dennis and working with the veterans over at the 12th Baptist, You know, giving them information that they didn't even know about and the impact. You know, to go in there, you know, veterans are always looking for, and here's a guy that comes in and has the answers. to help them out. And that's why we must be more forceful in what we do, especially when they're trying to take away as they are in the dark house. I won't say the White House. I just want to put that in there.

Thank you, Haywood. Did anybody say something to me? No. Okay. Dennis?

My roots are from South Boston from 1955, and I've moved to the country. But the HERO Act, they have a clause in there for the real estate. Some of the towns haven't even passed for their real estate exemptions because they were anti-veteran. That's how bad it is. When Middleborough passed, we had, I think, 250 veterans at the town meeting. And they were vocal, and we got it passed. But some of the towns out near Gardner and the mid part of the state haven't passed it. And I think that's a sin.

Thank you, Dennis, and thank you, Heywood. I'm going to go on to Councilor Mejia. But before I do that, Heywood, you mentioned a great point In what Dennis is doing, a lot of veterans don't know that they're eligible for certain programs, certain benefits. They're not getting anything that they've earned. So this is an opportunity also, maybe in the next round, if you can give out your contact information. We just want to make sure that any veteran that might be watching this knows exactly who to call if they are in need of services. But having said that, I want to go back to Councilor Mejia. Councilor Mejia, you have the floor.

Thank you. All right. So I have questions for both the administration and community. Is that okay, Councilor Flynn?

Yeah, of course. Yep.

All right, so Commissioner Santiago, it's always great to see you. I'm curious if you can, and if these questions have already been asked from my colleagues, please disregard. I don't want to waste your time. But I'm curious if you can walk us through what immediate impacts your office in particular. We could anticipate due to the shutdown, like just kind of like if you can walk us through what would be the immediate threats that your office would face And what emergency measures or contingency plans are in place to support veterans who may lose access to benefits or income during this time? What does the safety net look like and what we should be paying attention to? and what you think other departments might be able to do to stand in that gap. Because I don't think it's fair for us to think that your office is going to carry everything. This would be an opportunity for other city departments to stand in that gap. And if so, which departments do you think would be the best ones suited to help support? Maybe it's the Mayor's Office of Housing, you know, the Boston Public Health Commission. Like, think through some of You know, those other partners that we could potentially lean into to help support. And then what additional resources or support from the city council? Like this is like everybody has a role to play. And so I'm curious on our end here on the council, what would you say would be the most helpful to your office right now?

Thank you, Councilor Mejia, for your thoughtful questions. We did touch a little bit on those things. Pretty much the way to take care of our veterans, like I had stated, is that it takes a village. You know, I have all these partners to my left and to my right here who have been very, very instrumental in ensuring that our veterans are taken care of, that our veteran families are also taken care of, and also the military that reside in our neighborhoods are also taken care of. So having their help, their assistance, their advocacy is what's pushing us through that finish line to ensuring that our veterans are taken care of. The same thing could be said for all of the city departments, all of the city agencies as well. You know, we, you know, the Veterans Service is part of Human Services. There's a reason why we're part of Human Services, because we work very closely with the other departments under Chief Massot. So that's also very important to us. Rather it be BCYF, rather it also be, you know, the Age-Drunk Commission. or even returning citizens. So it's very important that it's a village to take care of our veterans, especially our veterans, since they're the ones that were in the front lines to ensure that we are the great nation that we are today. So the short answer is the village. And that village is the city of Boston, all of the city of Boston departments, as well as the great partnerships that we have with the other veteran organizations that we have in the city.

Thank you. Thank you for that. And what about the city council? Well, you didn't mention us in that line of the village, but I heard the departments. What about us? Tell us what to do.

You guys are doing it right now. You're elevating the issue. Having this conversation right here. You know, making sure that it's going out and broadcasted to the rest of the city as well. I have never, you know, I'm fortunate to have the support of the city council as well. I've always had the support of the city council. and you guys always keep me on my toes as well, so you know, So, you know, you give me challenge, which is great, which is what I expect. So elevating, you know, our veterans in this forum right here, and also when we go out into the community and talking about what Veterans Services does also helps out as well. also supporting all of our great events that we have. We just had a very successful fair and expo at Gordine Park in Roxbury. Seeing city council members there, seeing the mayor there, seeing other department heads there, really, really is what we need. is to, you know, because you're the forward facing of our community. You know, the city council is, the mayor is, all the department heads as well as all the chiefs. So by getting the words out there that these services are being impacted by the VA, either good or not good, is what I'm very happy to say that is happening. Again, elevating the veteran issues in this forum is definitely a great, great step forward.

Flynn, could I get? Of course. Okay. So thank you for that. And I think that for me, when you know better, you do better. And I think oftentimes a lot of the work that I've been doing has been focusing more on education issues. violence prevention. But I think I have an opportunity to really incorporate when we're out advocating and saying, and this is what it looks like for veterans. And when it comes to housing insecurity and food insecurity, here's how it impacts Thank you very much. Thank you. when we're in community around issues of veterans. And I think that that is really a great suggestion that you made that for us to continue to elevate those issues on our platforms and everywhere we go. So thank you for that. I'll start being more mindful. of that. And you already know I got a big mouth, so I got you with that. Now, I do have a question I see Councilor Murphy acknowledging that I do, it's a good, I use my microphone in a good way, y'all. I just want you all to know. So I'm curious for, and I'm transitioning over to the advocates. I'm from and I believe you probably answered this already and if you did I apologize but I'm gonna ask and I'd like to know a little bit more about what are some of the main top concerns that the veteran community is most Worried About. Is it housing? Is it food insecurity? Is it benefits? Kind of like if you could just kind of help us understand that. And how can the city better partner with community-based organizations to fill in the gaps when federal government can't? Because I believe, you know, government does play a role but we need everybody to step up I always talk about that we are resource rich but coordination poor like there's so many people doing good work but I don't really see How we could be more aligned with community organizations and groups so that we could better Provival Support Services. So if you all can name what that could potentially look like. And then what immediate actions or policy recommendations would you like to see from the Boston City Council to support veterans during the shutdown? That's a lot. And if you already answered it, I can go back to the tape and rewatch it. You don't have to go through that whole process for me again.

You know what? That's a good question. Well deserved, thank you. I think that, you know, corporate America is absent from Strategic Development for Veterans Services. And there are a lot of veterans in corporate America that need to know that What's a veteran always a veteran? And that they should consider helping us format this plan. And, you know, someone said earlier that it was you that said that You know, people take their cues from Boston and how we deal with our veterans. And I think that, you know, if you could show them how we can better treat veterans because for instance, veterans don't go to the VA in the manner that they should because of the lack of cultural sensitivity. So in our community, a lot of veterans that have mental health challenges, PTSD and other trauma stuff, and they don't have anywhere to go. You know, we should have places in our community. We should be able to ask corporate America to help us help veterans. And we don't do that. You know, in corporate America, doesn't say, well, what can we do to help the DAV? Maybe one or two people. But if you had an organized strategy to get people involved, I think that would alleviate some of the pressures that veterans have. and Access and Services and stuff. You have people like the commissioner, you know, who's well respected across the country. You have a panel discussion coming out of Boston about getting corporate America more involved. Like Amazon, a lot of guys that drive those trucks are veterans. You know, and so there's a connection, but we're not connecting. You know, it's just a thought that we should have in how we can get more people involved in better serving our veterans who have served. You can't get around that. We live in Boston, so Boston has all these corporate headquarters and say, You were a veteran, aren't you a veteran? Talking to one of the COC, I'm a veteran? What are you doing? You know, and so I think that a plan, you know, a series of questions to put it together with this committee, You know, it's a needed thing.

It's like corporate responsibility, right? Like there's a lot of folks who are doing business in Boston. And what does that look like? in terms of their support for our veterans and where are the levers of accountability there, right? I love the fact that we have big corporations. Okay, great, but how are you showing up Our communities, and I think that that's a really good question to ask.

Every time I go to Stop and Shop, I say that to myself. That's when I go to Stop and Shop, I look around and I say, What are they doing for veterans? Do they have a veteran's day? Where the veterans can come in and get something? You know? And it's not unreasonable to think like that. But we're not thinking like that.

And I love that. Haywood, because what it does, it gives us an opportunity to look at everybody and the role that everybody plays in supporting, going back to Commissioner Santiago's comment about the village, right? It's going to take all of us, every single one of us, government, corporate, nonprofits, different groups working together. That's the only way we're gonna survive this. If everyone is putting in whatever little grain of salt that they have, But we have to be the front line of defense at this moment. Like, now it's the opportunity for government to stand up on the front lines. I'm using military words just so y'all can identify with me, but we're going to be the front lines of defense when we're going to war in this situation because we are well suited and positioned. And I love the fact that you mentioned that Boston. It is. Everyone looks to us, right? And people are paying attention to what we do or what we don't do. And I think that we, you know, under Councilor Flynn's leadership, we have an opportunity to really make some bold moves and statements that other cities across all the municipalities can support. So just know that you got me. I'm one of your troops.

They say, they say, they say. Oh, that's the government. Let the government take care of them.

No.

No. And the government doesn't want to take care of us. That's why we're here now. That's right. Thank you.

Yeah. You gotcha. The veteran community is a big brotherhood and sisterhood. And he touched on it, mental health. Big delay in people's checks and stuff. More veterans will be at risk for suicide. And I've had two family members commit suicide, both veterans. and I've had many friends who are veterans commit suicide and it's a bad thing. They think about it all the time with their PTSD. And I have guys that call me any time of the day to talk. And if there's a real long shutdown, It's going to affect them.

Yeah. Sorry for your loss. And my cousin died by suicide as well. He was a veteran. And, you know, that is, I think mental health, I believe, is the next and the biggest pandemic that we're going to have to overcome here. We survived COVID, well, we think we did, but I think that mental health is gonna be the next pandemic that we're gonna all have to overcome.

They mentioned 22 a day. It's more. I heard somebody talk last week, and he's the only one that I've heard say it's between 20 and 40 veterans a day committing suicide.

It's a fluctuating number. We can begin to rethink our strategy. We have to rethink our strategy because we're not a one One answer all organizations. And so we have to add components to the strategy. You know, he's talking mental health. We're talking other things as well. You know, incarceration, we haven't spoken about incarceration and how do we deal with our veterans coming from incarceration? Do we recommend to have a program in place while they are incarcerated and have been identified? Thank you. Thank you. Structure a program for incarcerated veterans. Dryad has got help from Northeastern University School of Law to create a re-entry program that we've had for some time. We've also done Mental Health and did scientific surveys reflecting on the services that they're not getting at the BA Hospital. And we're going to try to reapply for another grant, you know, to deal with suicide ideations and stuff like that. Because these are the things that changes The courses of what a veteran really is. Or it's not. And finally, you know, I want to tell you that when you mentioned the thing about gay discharges and we want to try to have a conversation called the gathering of veterans that we can't judge a person by their sex preference if they're willing to die for this country. And so we want to bring the gathering together to talk about that.

Great. And I know you were anxious to say something. And I know my time is so up. And then that's it. I won't ask any more questions.

Thank you for those questions, Council. The simple answer to your initial question of which issues is actually D, all of the above. Because one issue is just not a complete standalone issue. Everything is interconnected. If a veteran, or even it goes beyond the veteran's community, you have an issue with the paycheck. With our active duty soldiers and our guardsmen coming up on the 15th and not receiving their paycheck. All right, that adds to their anxiety level. They don't get that paycheck. Okay, now they're going to be suffering from potentially food insecurity. They're going to be coming into the issue of housing insecurity because they're not going to be able to afford their rents because they didn't get paid and they can't put food on the table. So all that anxiety builds up and they could be also suffering from other mental health issues that, again, that added anxiety built into any PTSD, traumatic brain injury, Anything like that is just going to be coming overbearing. And God forbid, the last thing we want to happen, as Dennis was talking about those 22 to 40 a day, That's the last thing we want to see happen to any veteran, let alone anybody else. So really, everything is really interconnected. And I think the best thing that, one of the best things that the council can do is to ensure that Commissioner Santiago's department is fully funded and to ensure that His great team, and again, his team and him here are great partners with the veterans community, with all of the organizations, and for those that aren't even part of organizations. We're a big family, but we're a really small group. We sniff each other out in the parking lots of Stop and Shop. We're all rolling around in our Navy baseball caps. We know who each other are. So we'll give each other that, hey, what's up? And we keep that bond going. And we'll start talking. We'll find out what's bothering each other. And that is the catalyst to say, hey, I know a guy. Talk to Commissioner Santiago and his team. He'll be able to help you out. Talk to the DAV. They'll be able to, hey, the VFW, we've got this great post over in Dorchester. that you might be a great fit with. And DAV, VFW, American Legion, we're all big national organizations, but the real backbone of our organizations are The local post, our community post. The four posts that we've got within the City of Boston and a fifth one we're getting ready to bring online as well. The DAV's got their chapters in Boston. The Legion has posts across the city. It's those smaller groups throughout the city that are going to be As the city councillors, those are your inroads to the veterans community in your district. I know Commissioner, I'm sorry, Councillor Flynn is a member in... VFW member in South Boston, a Legion member in JP, I believe, right?

American Legion at the Cotter Post.

Right, okay, the Cotter Post. And a DAV member. So we've got, plus a DAV member. DAV member. We're all very accessible. I've gotten calls from Councillor Flynn and Councillor Murphy and if you have questions, have issues, or have One of your constituents has a question. We're all readily available. My phone's on 24-7 for work, for VFW, for whatever we need to do to help make sure that we take care of veterans across the city.

Thank you. I'm going to go on to...

He has something to say. He mentioned the prisons. The DAV has had a program that we go into the prisons and we've been waiting over a year to get the approval from the state. There's five of us that have gone into the prisons to talk to inmates who are getting ready to be released because while they're in prison, say if they were 100%, their check goes down to 10%. and they try to get their benefits back when they get out. But we had a program and it's been tied up in the state. I've filled out many applications for the background checks and everything else, but we haven't heard a thing and it's been over a year.

Yeah, that's a good point. Let me follow up with the State Department of Correction on that. and we can stay in contact. I do believe we need to do more work for veterans that are incarcerated. They might be incarcerated, but they're a veteran and they're entitled, they've earned these benefits. I do want to go to two of my colleagues that have also joined us, Councilor Weber and City Council President Louijeune. Councilor Weber, you're up next.

Thank you, Chair, and thank you to the panel. I apologize for being late. Madam President and I were at a The opening of a playground at the Curley School, so I spent time with sort of The youngest kids here in the city now. We get to talk to some older kids here on the panel. Yeah, you're still a kid, Haywood. So I apologize. Anything I'm asking, it's already been answered. Feel free just to tell me to watch the tape. But I guess Commissioner Santiago, In terms of what we're doing in terms of funding, people ask, there's a lot of aspects of the city, the Trump administration, they're attacking our funding. and Kansas City just fill in all the gaps. And my sense is there's not really, our budget is paying for very basic services that we need here and that for supplemental funding, We really needs to come from the state or federal government, that kind of thing. But can you just explain? If you haven't already, what our sources are for filling in these gaps if the Trump administration is going to continue attacking our veterans by taking away benefits and things like that? You know, have we maxed that stuff out? Is there anything else we can advocate at the state level for? I know there's 115 benefits, but you could just sort of explain where we can look for extra funds for our veterans.

Thank you, Councilor, for that question. So fortunately, our budget isn't affected by any of the federal cuts or anything that's going on in the Trump administration for that matter. But if and when the need is there, we have our Bridge the Gap program, and we are also currently working in trying to come up with a process with the state with regards to Chapter 115 to possibly either expedite any applications that may come in because of other veterans being furloughed or losing their positions within and many more, but also seeing if possibly having certain waivers for Chapter 115 during that timeframe where our veterans need assistance under Chapter 115. But right now, we are in a good place. We have a playbook already from past shutdowns that we have went back to with regards to taking care of our veterans to ensure that any gaps that may come up that we're able to cover.

Okay. And then I guess, hey, would anyone, are you, is there any benefits that you've lost that you want to talk about or that you think are under threat now that,

Well, you know, I was just thinking about your question to the Commissioner and to myself I was saying you know like a lot of times I say things to people about strategy and they look at me like I'm crazy you know but then later on the The impact of what I said hits them. And we began to go in that direction. So I don't know what it is that I need right now But I'm comfortable knowing that if I propose it, that it will be considered seriously, you know, in terms of funding, whether that's cash or resources or connecting me with people, that I'll get that to help the veterans. You know, because it's always about using the veteran and his or her skills because we're an overlooked resource. You know, I send you information like I send everybody 3 o'clock emails. you know about what we're doing in the community as veterans because veterans are overlooked and I'm just trying to you know get people to understand that that's a resource and that we need to be sure that the people in Washington, this time with the cutbacks and everything, don't jeopardize our future.

Just one more question and then I'll leave it to Madam President. I guess what impact, if any, we all watch the news, we've seen the President and the Secretary of Defense talk about how our military has let us down and we need to and many more. We have to start using them and deploying them in our streets and our cities and if anyone wants to address what kind of impact that is having on our veterans you know providing an invaluable service to our country and then I you know it's like seeing how what's happening now if that's if anyone wants to comment on that.

Thanks for that question there, Counselor. From the point of view of the veterans of foreign wars, We are apolitical. We don't want to chime in one way or another on the hot political topics of the day. When it comes down, Down to the brass tacks of it as long as you keep treating the veterans with the respect that we've earned continue with the benefits that we've earned That's the major important things. So whatever else is happening out in the street will have the tertiary effects to the veterans community by, again, increasing anxiety, Potentially witnessing triggering events on either TV or witnessing them in person that could bring them back to the battlefield, back to where they may have been injured, where they were served. and those could again help contribute to exasperate whatever conditions they may be suffering from their times in service. Looking down the road from these events that are involving our National Guard troops, our active duty troops within the homeland, there could be and probably will be lingering effects following their service. There's very high potential of them engaging with the general public and with any ancillary groups that might be Going, lack of a better term, going against them, if you will. These events will have lasting effects on the service members. So that's something that we're going to have to keep in mind for maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but next year and the years to follow that these young troops that are out there doing the government's bidding are going to have those lingering effects, not only of overseas issues, but there's service here within the homeland. And our benefits, our disability benefits don't just cover Wounds and injuries sustained in combat. They come back to stateside duty, garrison duty, where they may have been injured, again, within the line of duty, but not during combat, and they're still eligible for just compensation for the injuries that they did receive during the conduct of their duties. So, again, leaving the left-right politics out of it, looking ahead, yes, there will be lingering effects on the veteran and also the military community and our families.

Yeah, no, I would just, thank you. I think, thanks for that. And I'd just say that, and I think we saw in the first Trump administration that we relied on military leaders to sort of be the voice of reason in the White House, and they prevented some of the stuff that we're seeing now, and those people have been removed and shunted to the side in favor of political leaders, and we could We could use a lot, some of that leadership that we had before, you know, and that was people with a duty to country and defend the Constitution that, you know, we're missing now. Anyway, and I feel like it's something we should maybe come back to if what's happening in Chicago and around the country happens here, how we're going to support veterans. You know, who have to go through that. So, thank you very much, Chair. I appreciate it.

Chair Greg Musil Thank you, Council Weber, Council President Louijeune.

Thank you and good morning to everyone. And thank you for your service to this country. Thank you to our great commissioner here, Commissioner of Veterans Services, Robert Santiago, and so many of you who have served and who continue to serve. Haywood, I love seeing those emails and we are grateful here in the city for your advocacy. I think this is a very clear example of how national issues affect us at the local level. and how it is incredibly important for us here in the city of Boston to be We have no choice but to be looking at what's happening at the federal government because it affects our budgets, and most importantly, it affects our residents. But what I'm hearing from you, Commissioner Santiago, and apologies like Councilor Weber stated, If you stated this already, but there's a plan in place and that you feel pretty good about the continuity of care and of services to our veterans and to members of military to the best extent that we're able to plug in the gaps that you will be doing so.

Yes, Madam President, I am. Having, again, these great organizations Supporting us here in the city of Boston, having all the other departments within the city, the city agencies also there to help us whenever we need help, and also this body here, the city council as well. Knowing that all these pieces are in place to help our veterans community, to help our veterans family, I feel confident in the continuity of services for them.

Thank you. You know, in the same way, I think two weeks ago I was on a call and there was so much panic among residents. who are worried about their SNAP benefits, who are worried about food justice and food insecurity, which is a big issue. Have you been seeing that level of panic from our veterans community? Have folks been calling and like what's going to happen or where do I turn and have we been able to connect them to the right resources?

We haven't had that in volume just yet. A lot of one-off conversations that I have had with veterans, they are concerned, but they're not overly concerned yet. It's just like what was discussed earlier. If and when the next paycheck is going to come in and how they're going to be taken care of if that paycheck doesn't come in. So a lot of it is just the unknown of what's going to happen tomorrow or the next day. or even, who knows, the next hour with the way things have been going. But right now, the overlying concern is what's gonna happen next. But as of now, we haven't, really received a good amount of phone calls or emails pertaining to the veterans' concerns.

Thank you. Anyone else if they've heard any sort of like panic from?

Thank you, Madam President. From the VFW side of the House, we're not seeing the panic, but a lot of, again, like Commissioner Santiago mentioned, questions are being asked. And utilizing our great cross-organization networks that we have, We're connecting folks with the best information that we have that's being put out on social media. That's been a godsend a lot of times work. You know, yes, the age of disinformation, but we know where our trusted sources are. And we're able to put out the information that we're receiving from the VA, from the city veteran services. And again, with our groups, Now working together and our networks, we're able to connect our veterans with the right person and the right organization to be able to Thank you. Thank you. We've got our National Guard troops that are forward deployed overseas or down on the border preparing to deploy. They're concerned about October 15th. What's going to happen with their paychecks? Are they going to get those paychecks? And some units are We're starting to lean forward a little bit to be prepared. So if that funding does affect them and they're on some sort of active duty and their supply chain, if you will, is interrupted and They're not able to access three hot meals a day. Resorting to the meals ready to eat, these wonderful sea rats. I'd rather sea rats than MREs sometimes, but where is that next good meal going to come to? I know from the VFW, we're starting to talk amongst ourselves from the local posts at the community level that we're going to be there for our current military and their families. We're the backstop. Should the federal government fail them, state government? I know our city government is not going to fail our veterans. But we are there as that backstop with our relief efforts for our veterans to make sure that they're They're fed, they're clothed, they're housed, and we're going to do our darndest to make sure that that happens. And again, my comrades here at this table and our individual groups, we're going to make sure that does happen.

Thank you. And I just want to say thank you again for your service. And just a reminder that things that are happening at the national level of this federal government affects us deeply locally. And I'm glad that the panic hasn't started. I know that there's a lot of pain, as I said, food insecurity, so much going on in this city, but I'm glad that You know, when there is panic or if there is panic, that you all are getting ready and standing in the gap. So, Commissioner, you know that this body is here to be of service. And when you tell us to jump, we're ready to say how high. Thank you.

Thank you, ma'am.

Thank you. Madam President and Councilor Weber for being here. Thank you to Councilor Mejia for sponsoring it, to Councilor Murphy as well for being an original co-sponsor. I don't see any questions yet, so I'll start mine now, and then I'll see if there's any public testimony as well. So let me start with the commissioner. Commissioner, the date of October 15th, that is the date potentially that military may not get paid. Is that accurate?

That is correct. I could check for sure, but I believe you're correct on that.

Okay, so Commissioner, and I'll follow up with you after as well, but as you know, We have a lot of Coast Guard men and women that live in Boston. We also have a lot of other active duty people in the reserves that might be on active duty. But I was going to ask you, Commissioner, could we talk offline, but I think maybe coming up with a working group of people that could possibly be there for The Coast Guard, Families. If the government shutdown impacts them financially, just want to see what your thoughts might be, Commissioner.

We could definitely have that conversation. I know in the past we have had that conversation with them and letting them know that the city is here to support them. The city is here to support our active duty service members and their families. who live in our communities. So it's definitely something that I'm sure that we could talk about. I know the Constitution, one of the things that's affected them is they're unable to give any tours. on board the ship, but yet they're still there ensuring and protecting the ship as well, especially with the shameless plug here, the Navy birthday coming up next week as well, and also the Constitution's birthday coming up as well. But it's definitely worth having that conversation with the Coast Guard, with the Constitution, and also with the Army that are stationed here as well, and the Air Force, pretty much.

No, that's excellent, Commissioner. Thank you. So one of the panelists mentioned MST, which is military sexual trauma, but also PTSD, post-traumatic stress disorder. We talked about the high rate. obviously of suicide. Of veterans, it could be as high as 30 a day. It's certainly at least 20 a day. in MST does impact a lot of women veterans as we know. PTSD impacts a lot of veterans, both men and women. My question is, During this government shutdown, for a woman veteran or for anyone that's dealing with PTSD, do we specifically know if a government shutdown would impact counseling services? That a veteran might be engaged in on any of those types of subjects or issues whether it's What are your thoughts in terms of how What impact this government shutdown would have on those very important issues, sensitive issues? Do we have an understanding of that?

Well, from my understanding, the VA is not going to shut down Any services related to PTSD or mental health concerns. Like I said earlier, the crisis hotline is still going on 24-7. The crisis hotline, all you have to do is dial 988, then press 1, and that'll get you to the services that that veteran needs. or even if someone is concerned about a veteran, please dial 988 and then press 1. Those services are still not affected or we were told are not to be affected By the VA at all or any counseling sessions with regards to PTSD or any mental health issues that our veterans are having. So from what we were told by the VA, no, those services are not to be affected by the shutdown.

So, Rob, as a follow-up, are there services at the VA medical, whether it's in Jamaica Plain, whether it's in West Roxbury or Brockton or Providence, are there any type of medical services programs that are impacted?

Not that I know of. From my understanding, again, the VA, any services through the VA medical centers, through the community outpatients centers as well, and also to the vet centers, The 40 or so vet centers throughout the country are not affected by anything regarding the federal shutdown. So any VA medical services should not be affected by the shutdown.

Hey, Wood, what are your thoughts?

You know, I'm going to tell you something. You know, hindsight is 20-20. That's what they say, right? But there should be a way, and I believe that there is, where you can ascertain the number of people that you're asking about through a system created using The data from the VA and from the other community-based organizations like Cahuilla Street that provide that kind of service, that they fill in the data so that you can be able to analyze the data and if this situation comes up, and we are in a crisis situation, you will know exactly where to go to get that information and get it to the commissioner so his office will have that because you do have people that don't go to the VA and access services that are VA connected in community-based organizations. And till such time as we're able to get them to trust the VA system, they're gonna continue to displace The community-based, client-based, because they will not say that they are veterans. They'll just go in and get the services. They don't have to use where they have the benefits to go. So that's the A money situation. But people are not looking at that like that. And so I just think that you need a way to certify who's getting served and where they're getting served. and how they're getting served.

Thank you, Haywood. That's a good point. That's a good point that you make is the services that are available to all veterans What are their contact information? How do they access those programs?

But they could, especially being in the community, they could have... Guys coming out of jail, if you had some kind of way, To ascertain coming out of jail, you'd be able to get that data because it's all, you know, right there for us to collect while they're there. Are you a veteran? You're a bomber. And what are we giving you? Are you taking any kind of medication? Why are you taking that medication? Mental Health. So when he comes out, we're able to channel that person to where they need to go.

That's a good point. Thank you, David. Maybe a quick follow-up to Commissioner Santiago and I wanted to follow up on Dennis' comment about accessing the Department of Correction. So I'm going to try to get a Zoom meeting maybe with the Commissioner of Correction maybe over the next couple of weeks. Seeing about the possibility of getting the DAV and maybe Haywood could be part of it too, but getting the DAV back into the prison system so that they can talk about Talk to veterans about services and programs. But Rob, would you be interested in joining us on a call if we do talk to the Department of Correction?

Yeah, most definitely. And just to add to that, I actually did go to Bridgewater Correctional Facility earlier this year with Commander Meredith Tewitt, the American Legion. and we were able to talk to veterans in that correctional facility. But it's definitely worth, you know, continue that conversation and going to all the facilities and talking to those veterans.

Well, excellent. Thank you. Visiting Bridgewater and having an opportunity to join Meredith, who's actually my commander at the Cata Post. She was invited here also today as well. I have more questions, but in the interest of time, I do want to stop there and see if there is any public testimony at this time. Anyone in the public looking to testify? Okay. Okay. So we don't have any public testimony. And people that are watching on television, they can certainly Reach me, whether it's email, ed.flynn at boston.gov. You can send me an email about today's hearing and follow up if you have any issues relating to veterans or military families. Maybe my final question, and then I'm going to ask my colleagues to give closing statements. But my final question, could I just ask all five people on the panel, could you just say your name and your contact information because we do have a lot of people watching on television. If anyone wants to reach you directly, just give your name and number or your name and email address. Let me start with Dennis and we can move our way down.

Dennis Devine, Senior Vice Commander for the Department of Massachusetts DAV. My cell phone is 508-400-0328. My email is franden68 at gmail.com.

Hey, we're for now. Triad Veterans League. Triad Veterans League, Boston. 857-204-5312 here for you, thank you.

Craig Diold from the Directions of Foreign Wars, the State Senior Vice Commander. My cell is 781-738. 2498 or email is cdeold at vfwma.org.

Thank you. Robert Santiago, Commissioner of Veterans Services, City of Boston. Email robert.santiago at boston.gov. Phone number 617-635-3037.

Charlie Cook. I'm the commander of Chapter 3 of Boston for the DAV. Email is charliecook48 at msn.com. Phone number 617- 433-0884.

And ed.flynn at boston.gov and my cell phone number for any veteran that needs to reach me My cell phone number is 617-820-8571. 617-820-8571. And also a proud member of the DAV post with Charlie. so many others, and Craig. As Craig mentioned, I'm a VFW proud member in South Boston. I want to say thank you to the panel for being here, for the important work. All of you are doing, helping so many veterans, especially during this challenging time. Your leadership is exceptional and we're so proud to have you here. I do want to give all of my colleagues that are here an opportunity to give a final closing comment. Let me start with Councilor Murphy, then I'll go to Councilor Mejia. Weber, the City Council President, and then I'll give a closing statement. Councillor Murphy.

Thank you, Councillor Flynn, for letting me join you on this emergency hearing order and getting it scheduled so quickly. We just filed this last week. and I know we spoke about the 15th could be that first day, like I said, when my son called this morning. Many of those he's working alongside are worried and making sure we do everything we can for our active duty and also our veterans that you just show up every day for, and I appreciate that. I did just want to remind you, Commissioner, that you wanted to speak about the arthritis military benefits, so if you could take a minute to do that during my, I'll give you my closing time. But Council Flynn's giving us as much time as we need anyway. But if you could mention that, please.

So I'm also involved with the Arthritis Foundation. It's a great organization that I've been working with. They also want to amplify how arthritis is affecting our military and veterans community. which is, well, in the civilian community is one in four people have arthritis. And we're talking about 60 million people in the United States alone that are affected by arthritis. And that also includes 300 young kids as well. and it includes one in three veterans. And these veterans also have arthritis due to their service as well, where they could be carrying around 100 pound rucksacks on a daily basis, or it could be doing repetitive motions on a daily basis due to their jobs or it could be that they were involved in an IED explosion wherever they were serving. So the Arthritis Foundation, they do great work. Just recently, I was able to talk about the Arthritis Foundation The effects of arthritis in veterans as well. There's gonna be a webinar in November as well. We have national leaders from the VA show up to these webinars as well and I'm a huge part of that. So if you want any more information on that, Please let me know. My information, again, is robert.santiago at boston.gov.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councilor.

Thank you, Council Murphy.

Council Mejia.

Flynn for chairing this hearing and for allowing me to participate and thank you all for your fierce advocacy I am always want to say that nothing about us without us is for us and it's so important for the people who are living the realities and or doing the work to really have a seat at the table letting us know what we can do to step up for you all. So this was a really good example of what that looks like when we're bringing all the right voices into the chamber. So I just want to thank you for your service and thank you for your relentless advocacy and know that you have an advocate on this side of things if there's anything that we can do to be supportive. And I really do like the idea that Councilor Fitzgerald suggested earlier to Councilor Flynn is potentially being the leaders in Boston. There's a way for us to sign a letter and advocate Flynn, you have my support. So I'll add my name to that letter. I'm sure that you're going to be writing it. And I'm here for all of it. And so I just want to thank you all. for your support and showing up for the folks that we definitely know are the most vulnerable. So thank you. Thank you for your fierce advocacy.

Thank you. Thank you, Councilor Mejia. Councilor Weber, you're in the hot seat.

Thank you. Yeah, I just want to thank Chair Flynn for filing this and for highlighting the needs of our veterans, and it's something that Flynn, however the city can support our veterans, I'm happy to stand behind Councilor Flynn who I'm sure will be leading the way and support him. in how we can effectively do that. I'm just sorry I couldn't be here when we started, but I want to thank everyone for being here, and I'm just glad I could, or honored that I could just You'll lend my support for this and you'll just know that you'll have my support going forward. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Council Weber. Council President?

Thank you and I want to thank Councilor Flynn for having this hearing. I want to thank my colleagues for being here. and I want to thank all of you for your incredible work. Craig, Haywood, Dennis, our Commissioner, Charlie, thank you for your service and thank you for standing in the gap when it's most needed. Really appreciate it. Thank you.

Thank you, Council President. Yes, go ahead, Dennis.

I'd like to invite all of you out to Castle Island on November 8th. The DAV is having their 5K. and it's a great event. It's one of our big fundraisers. There's gonna be all types of people there. I believe Channel 4 will be there. Sometimes it gets chilly out there. One year it was nine degrees. So all he is invited to come out to visit on November 8th.

Well, thank you, Dennis. I appreciate that. It's a wonderful event. I do want to give everyone on the panel here an opportunity if you'd like to give a brief closing statement as well. Each person take a minute or two. Heywood, would you like to give a closing statement?

Thank you for the opportunity to speak on behalf of the veterans. Thank the City of Boston for showing the concern that you've shown over the years. You know, you can't get to a good place by yourself. You know, I'm really appreciative of this opportunity to sit here and speak for the veterans. Thank you. I'm looking forward to results, working with the commissioner.

Thank you. Thank you, Haywood. Craig?

Thanks again, Councilor Flynn and Madam President, the rest of the Councilors, for the opportunity to speak with you this morning. This is a very important issue that I'm glad to see the council taking a great leadership role and being prepared should the worst happen, that the council is ready to go and ready to support Commissioner Santiago, and the rest of the veterans of the city of Boston. As we said earlier, it takes a village, and we've got the defenders of that village right up here that even though we're not We're not in active service anymore in the military, but we're all still active for each other and for all the veterans We serve, and it doesn't matter what organization we are, we're all serving veterans. And that's the most important thing. And again, my comrades at this table, and with your support from the council, We know that Boston will continue to be leaders throughout the Commonwealth and across the country in taking outstanding care of our veterans, military families, and military service members. So again, thank you for all of your efforts and all of your support.

Thank you Craig. Commissioner?

Thank you chair again for this opportunity and thank you to the council for once again prioritizing those who served. One thing that I do want to say is I'm very proud of being at this table With these veterans, with these fellow veterans of mine, you know, Craig just touched on a point is, you know, we don't wear the uniform anymore, but we don't have to wear the uniform to continue serving our community. And you can see with all these organizations, it's not about You know, having a brick and mortar where you can go have a drink. It's about advocacy. It's about call to action. And that's what we're doing up here for our fellow veterans and for their families as well, is a call to action. all these organizations, whether it be the VFW, the American Legion, the DAV, they all have summits in DC, advocacy summits where you and myself, Councilor, we have gone down both with the DAV and the VFW in those advocacy sessions with our Boston delegation to talk about the needs of our veterans in our community, which is why the reason the HERO Act got packed here in the state of Massachusetts, why the PACT Act got approved in Congress as well. So this is what advocacy looks like in the veterans community. And I couldn't be more proud to be part of this group, part of this Village. And I'm also very proud that the city council, that Mayor Wu and her administration also advocates for all veterans as fiercely as they do, not just in the city, but in the state and throughout the country. And I've said it before. You know, I think I listened to the whole four-hour session when Mayor Boo was down in Congress, and I believe she was the only one that mentioned veterans when she was talking and, you know, down there in Congress. So it makes me proud to be the commissioner here, but it's also... lets me know that I have a huge responsibility to continue the work that I do with these gentlemen up here, with the veterans community, with the city council, and with everyone out there who wants to ensure that our veterans are taken care of.

Thank you, Commissioner, and thank you for the important leadership you provide every day to Boston residents and residents, Boston veterans and veterans across the country as well. Charlie?

Yeah, I just want to thank everybody for the invitation. It's a great opportunity to speak for our veterans. The panel, council, everything's been really great. Hope we can do more. I haven't been back in here in about 10, 15 years since I retired, but the city of Boston is still one of the greatest cities around.

Well, thank you, Charlie, and thank you to the panel here and City Councilor and now State Senator Lydia Edwards testified. Earlier, I want to thank City Councilor and Senator Edwards as well, who's also a veteran. This is, as we all know, is an emergency hearing that we held. to discuss the impact that the federal government is having on Boston veterans, military members, military families. Veteran benefits will be impacted, as we said, by this ongoing government shutdown. We're going to continue to work with military members and with veterans as well, including the Coast Guard and the Navy that have a lot of residents that do live in the city. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. and federal government as Haywood highlighted in his opening statement. The City of Boston Veterans Services under Commissioner Santiago has done an exceptional job. Working with veterans, again, across the city. Commissioner Yuppot of the Wu administration. I want to thank Mayor Wu, but I also want to thank the Governor, Governor Healy, and Lieutenant Governor Driscoll. Our leaders in Congress as well, including Elizabeth Warren and Ed Markey, both United States senators. And in Boston, our congressional elected officials, Stephen Lynch, and our former colleague on the City Council, Ayanna Pressley. It is critical that our veterans, military members, military families are treated with respect, especially during this government shutdown, We need to do everything we possibly can to bridge that gap. If there are any services or programs that are impacted we need to be there to support our veterans and military members We know how important it is for them and their family to pay their bills to have food, but we also know that a lot of young military members in Boston Maybe they're E2 or E3 at the lowest level of pay in the military. They're not receiving a big paycheck every month or every other week. And food access is always an issue. for a lot of low-income veterans or low-income military members as well. So let's continue to work together. Have incredible respect for the five gentlemen and the state senator that were here earlier. It's about working together, treating each other with respect and want to say thank you. I want to say thank you to the city council central staff team that helps today. Navy veteran Shane Pack, thank you. and Ethan that does the video work. I want to say thank you to Ethan as well. This hearing on docket 1775, an emergency order for hearing to discuss the impact of the ongoing government shutdown on Boston's veterans, military members, and military families is adjourned. Thank you.